5:31 PM“I f— with the vision, fam. Let’s build.”

You know the meme, you know the sentiment and you know you’ve heard it once or twice in your life when you didn’t want to. But LaVar Ball — founder of Big Baller Brand and father of Lonzo Ball, the Los Angeles Lakers’ No. 2 overall pick in the 2017 NBA draft — never got that co-sign from anyone. At least, not until last weekend.

Jay-Z, onetime leader of Roc-A-Fella Records who is now a stay-at-home dad, co-signed the CEO from Chino Hills, California, during a wide-ranging interview with Rap Radar’s Elliot Wilson for Tidal. (Disclosure: Wilson is married to Danyel Smith, culture lead here at The Undefeated.)

With the waves of Malibu Beach crashing in the background, Wilson, Brian “B.Dot” Miller and Shawn Carter sat down to discuss 4:44 the album, a seminal work for Jay-Z. He talks at length about what he learned about his creative process, the experience of making the “Footnotes” series in which he discussed various portions of the project with other celebrities, and how he decided to market the release overall. It’s regular-season from Wilson, this time with a bigger star than usual.

Then, the convo turned to Ball.

“LaVar Ball, he said, ‘I’m going to start my own company.’ Everybody’s like, ‘You’re just mad at Nike.’ He may go about things wrong, he may have a big mouth. But I bought three pairs. Why did I buy three pairs? That man has a vision of his own. Why wouldn’t I support him? Why wouldn’t I support him? He feels like he can move culture, and his son got a big enough name, and a big enough brand, that they can do it.”

That’s right, Jay-Z is a fan of Ball’s sneaker company. While he doesn’t exactly represent the youth market that Ball usually operates in, it’s still a big co-sign. Jay-Z might be the uncle at the cookout, but that’s exactly who these shoes are for. Or, big ballers, for lack of a better term, of which Jay-Z certainly is one.

Perhaps more important, though, is the notion of legitimacy that Jay-Z addresses regarding how Ball was initially received in his venture. For whatever reason, a lot of the refrain around BBB’s kicks was related to the basics of whether he could even put together a proper shoe. As if Nike is the first to make sneakers that could stand the test of a basketball game.

It seemed like such a strange critique. Did people really believe that because LaVar was a dude they’d never heard of that he couldn’t be resourceful enough to make shoes? It’s not like you have to be from Wakanda to find the materials to construct sneakers. How do you think Nike is making so much money? It sure as heck isn’t on production costs.

“Nike had to start somewhere,” Jay-Z continued. “Why do we get so upset when we, us as a culture, want to start our own s—? That s— is puzzling to me. I sit back like, and I’m like, ‘This makes no sense.’ ” There are obvious parallels to Stephon Marbury’s situation, when he released his sneakers and was widely mocked, even though they sold well.

But then, whether inadvertently or not, Jay-Z brings up a topic that’s both hilarious and fascinating. “They [aren’t] any more terrible than … I’ve seen some bad sneakers from Under Armour,” he said. “I’ve seen some bad Michael Jordan sneakers. Horrible.”

No. 1, Carter himself has some pretty awful sneakers. They sold well enough but were not a smash hit by any measure, and you certainly don’t see anyone outside of the biggest of fans rocking them these days. But that leads me to the next natural thought: What if this co-sign had come earlier? Or what if he’d even been involved himself?

We’d likely be far less critical of Ball as a businessman than we would have Jay-Z. After all, if you’re already rich, it makes sense to charge high prices for your clothes, right? Even if Ball’s shoes weren’t a hit, to think that his point was made and resonated as far as someone like Jay-Z, who actually went as far as to buy multiple pairs, is important.

It means that he’s caught the eye of his market, and succeeded. Or in other words, LaVar wins.